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Re: Seriously now...Re: More evidence straight from the Liver Flush Support Forum
 
Hveragerthi Views: 11,220
Published: 10 years ago
 
This is a reply to # 1,849,702

Re: Seriously now...Re: More evidence straight from the Liver Flush Support Forum


 >>>So for starters what she is describing IS NOT an anxiety attack as the doctors stated.<<<

So, even though...

I should have known that it would not be long before you came out from under your bridge.  You take every opportunity you can to attack me.  By the way, I loved your claim about diatomaceous earth having a hardness of 7 when in REALITY it is only 1-1.5.  Got a great laugh out of that one.  But have to say that  recommending blood thinning cayenne for a possible aneurysm was really potentially deadly advice!!!

---this person has had gallbladder attack/s in the past and certainly knows what one feels like (but did NOT think she was experiencing a gallbladder attack, and would likely have known if she was)

She was having classic signs of a bad gallbladder attack shortly after drinking a bunch of oil for flush when she had a gallbladder packed with stones.  Even a m*o*o*n can put 2 and 2 together.  And yes, she had other attacks, milder do the smaller amounts of fats/oils ingested.  Again it does not take a genius to figure out the more oil the stronger the contractions.  And the lodging of a stone had already put her in the hospital once with pancreatitis.  I would not be surprised at all if she had done a flush right before that attack as well that ended her up in the hospital.

--the doctor in the ER diagnosed a panic/anxiety attack, and it was relieved by Ativan/Morphine (Ativan being a benzodiazepine which is commonly & effectively used for panic/anxiety)

Did you bother to consider that it would take massive anxiety attack to cause the symptoms she mentioned with the muscles and that would only happen from hyperventilation, but she clearly stated several times she could not breathe?  In other words it WAS NOT an anxiety attack.  But the morphine would stop her pain making he feel better.  You really should stop giving medical advice when you clearly don't have a clue what you are talking about.  In fact I have had to bite my tongue a number of times after reading your recommendations to people.  I am really surprised that you have not put anyone in the hospital yet or worse!!!

Her symptoms fit a major gallbladder attack perfectly and it would also explain her statement "Couldn't walk, my hands and arms went stiff...", which is not a symptom of anxiety with hypoventilation.

--the oil was ingested  the night before this event (likely around 10-12  hours before), and anyone that's experienced a gallbladder attack knows it happens very quickly after ingesting fats & oils.

Where did she make that statement?  Please put a link to the post where she states that.

--you've never met this person, seen their labs and know nothing more than you've read in a very short posting history...

Same applies to you Uny.  For example, how well do you know her to know when she ingested the oil?  Have you seen her labs?  Do you even know the differential symptoms of anxiety and a gallbladder attack?

Even with all this, you KNOW this was NOT an anxiety attack and claim it was a gallbladder attack caused by flushing.

Again, if you knew ANYTHING about medicine then you would know that what she described is not a symptom of anxiety with hypoventilation.  They are symptoms of a major gallbladder attack,  for which she has a history of.  Do you know her well enough to say that she has a history of major anxiety attacks?  Quit pretending that you know things you know nothing about.

You consider this type of "reasoning" to be valid (?), while questioning and ridiculing the same of others.

If you were able to read symptoms then you would understand that what she had WAS NOT an anxiety attack.  But hey, you know squat about medicine. But we all know you get your jollies from taking any advantage you can to attack me.  That is the only reason you came back out from under your bridge.  Same as the last time you responded to me and the time before......   

And for what it's worth, not everyone agrees with your lactate/anxiety theory:

JURGEN MARGRAF, DIPL-PSYCH, ANKE EHLERS, DIPL-PSYCH, AND
WALTON T. ROTH, MD

www.psychosomaticmedicine.org/content/48/1/23.full.pdf
Response to sodium lactate infusions has been proposed as an experimental model and a biologic
marker for panic attacks. Several authors have claimed that patients suffering from panic attacks,
but not normal controls, "panic" in response to lactate. A careful review of methods and results
of 13 studies, however, reveals serious methodologic problems, lack of specificity and sensitivity,
and a failure to consider cognitive variables. When baseline differences are ruled out,
the responses of patients and controls may not differ. So far, response to lactate cannot be
interpreted as a model and marker for panic attacks and does not provide evidence for their
underlying biologic distinctness from other types of anxiety. Known biologic mechanisms do
not sufficiently explain the effects of lactate. Instead, an interaction of peripheral physiologic
changes, past experience, environmental cues, and their appraisal as threatening or dangerous
seems to be a more appropriate model.

There are plenty of other researchers that would disagree with him since this has been demonstrated enough times in the research.

::: sitting back in my chair, getting ready to 'click off' the inevitable 'recording' about what's wrong with me and my reasoning, what's wrong with what I know & believe, how many times you've proven I am wrong, and how that's the reason I'm 'attacking' you :::

Whatever you say, Hver...whatever you say.

So you are denying that you jump on the bandwagon to attack me every chance you get.  Should we pull up some of your posting history showing how you have done this over and over?

 

 
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