Sara Suten Seti vs. True Islam (Wesley Muhammad) - What Will Come Out of Their Debate?

Sara Suten Seti vs. True Islam (Wesley Muhammad) - What Will Come Out of Their Debate?

by Djehuty Ma'at-Ra
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Fresh off the heels of his debate with Moorish community stand out and scholar, Alim Bey, the fiery, energetic, and raw Sara-Suten-Seti accepts the challenge of the Nation of Islam's foremost scholar and researcher, Dr. Wesley Muhammad, a/k/a/ True Islam in, New York City on June 27, 2009.

This is a debate that I personally endorse because I feel the Black community needs stimulating debate which I feel can prove very beneficial to all the Blacks, especially Black youth, who are suffering from major identity crisis and/or searching for their true national and cultural identity.

As Tavis Smiley said a few years ago, "Black people are not a monolithic people," and I would concur with this statement which is factual on its face. While most Blacks in the United States may agree that we are an African people, or Africans, or the descendants of Africans, we are still mostly segmented and divided into different camps which claim to be Black folks (in America) true and rightful identity and family.

There's the Moorish Science Temple which claims Blacks in the U.S. are Moors by nationality, thus linking Blacks to a nation (Morocco) and thus allowing them to claim their sovereignty. These are the Moors who follow Noble Drew Ali.

There's the Lost-Found Nation of Islam (NOI) which is just as divided and segmented as the various street gangs of the nation, with at least four or five men all claiming to be the leader of the organization, from Minister Louis Farrakhan, Royal (Solomon), and Silis Muhammad. That Nation of Islam teaches that Blacks in the U.S. true identity is that of Asiatics (Asiatic Black man), descendants of the Tribe of Shabazz. The Nation of Islam teaches that the entire Earth is the Black man and woman's home.

There's the Hebrew Israelites, a/k/a the Black Jews, who teach, especially on busy street corners in major U.S. cities, that Blacks in the U.S. are members of the 12 Tribes of Israel (one of them), thus making Blacks true cultural identity that of a Hebrew or Jew.

There's the Nuwaubian Nation of Moors whose leader, Dr. Malachi Z. York, is serving a life sentence behind bars, the victim of an alleged government Conspiracy as claimed by many of his followers. This sect teaches that Blacks in the U.S. are actually Nuwaubians but also, Moors, Hebrews, and Muslims, in a certain respect. The message of this group is ever-evolving, to their credit in my opinion because it shows growth and I believe this is why the Nauwabians started to really outshine all other Black groups and organizations, especially the Nation of Islam, a one-time hands down leader for Black people; plus, the Nuwaubians clearly embrace their Kemetic ancestry whereas the Nation of Islam, Hebrew Israelites, and others disavow Kemet and focus on Israel and Mecca, Arabia; lands that most Blacks in America cannot relate to.

Aside from these groups and organizations above, you have a strong black nationalistic movement in America, pan-African movement, RBG (Revolutionary But Gangsta, Righteous But Gangsta, Red/Black/Green) movement put on the map by rap group 'Dead Prez' one of my favorite rap groups of all-time; the NGE (Nation of Gods/Earth, 5 Percenters), an Afro-centric movement, and even a Kemeticentric and metaphysical movement led by the likes of Rev. Phil Valentine-El and Bobby Hemmit.

I personally believe all of these groups, camps, organizations, and schools of thought have much to offer Black people collectively, especially in the area of spiritual and cultural consciousness and development, though in my honest opinion, they all are fragile when it comes to fostering economic stability and growth for the Black community.

The June 27th debate between Seti and True Islam addresses a very important subject pertaining to Black people's history and the religion of Islam. Until the Afrocentric movement really boomed in the 1990s, it was generally accepted than Islam was a good religion and way of life for Black people, but with research from the likes of notable and credible black scholars and researchers such as Walter Williams, Ashra Kweisi, Dr. Yosef Ben Jochannan, Mathu Ater, Chancellor Williams, and Dr. John Henrik Clark becoming more noticeable and in demand, Islam has been exposed as a foreign religion that denigrated Africa and Africans and was pushed on Blacks just as Christianity was. Many even started to call Islam nothing but glorified Christianity.

Islam has since been exposed by these above researchers and scholars and others as an Arab religion that many Blacks are unknowingly mentally and culturally colonized in. Basically, you have confused Black people walking around claiming to be Arabs; dressing, speaking, and walking like Arabs, even speaking and praying in Arabic. This is what was being said and taught in so many words by Afrocentrics and Kemetologists according to members of the Black Muslim community and many Black Muslims began to resent the Afrocentric and Kemeticentric communities, going as far as even seeing them as enemies of Islam.

I don't think anyone can doubt the positive and beneficial contributions of Islam, especially the Nation of Islam, to the Black community over the past decades. However, the Nation of Islam's foundation is very fragile when one learns the hidden origins of the organization and movement, which undoubtedly originates from the teachings of the prophet Noble Drew Ali and the Moorish Science Temple. This is an origin members of the Nation of Islam will deny, but nobody exposed this apparent truth and fact more so than Dr. Malachi Z. York, who wrote numerous publications exposing the historical origins of the Nation of Islam, which made Dr. York and his organization (as well as the Moorish Science Temple which also exposed the Moorish origins of the Nation of Islam), enemies of the Nation of Islam.

The once mighty and flamboyant Nation of Islam has lost much of its appeal within the Black community since the advent of black nationalism, pan-Africanism, Afrocentricity, and Kemetology or Kemeticism; and since 1994 or the Million Man March, the Nation of Islam, all sects (especially Farrakhan's sect), has been dying a gradual death, losing its stronghold over the hearts and minds of Black people, especially Black youth. Many cite Farrakhan's change in direction, his reunion with Warith Deen Mohamed which many NOI loyalists saw as a move to take the NOI into orthodox Islam; his getting involved with mainstream politics, and his spending too much time preaching about Jesus, perhaps trying to placate and woo the Christian community whom Farrakhan sought as an ally.

I truly believe the final deathblow to the Nation of Islam, at least Louis Farrakhan's sect, was the isolation and rejection of Dr. Khalid Abdul Muhammad in the mid-1990s. Muhammad clearly began to take a more Afrocentric approach to things, even dressing in traditional African colors, verbalizing African chants and words, and educating his audiences on Afrocentric and Kemetic themes during his lectures and speaking engagements.

Many people suggested that Khalid may have become too black for the Nation of Islam, which promotes a very light-skinned and near-White or Caucasian looking man as God, which also makes a lot of people question the pro-black stance of the Nation of Islam.

Many believe what I described above, was one of the major reasons that got Khalid exiled from the Nation of Islam (NOI). With Khalid leaving the sect, or actually being pushed out, many Afrocentric and Kemetic NOI sympathizers left with Dr. Khalid and NOI membership numbers have been dwindling ever since.

Whereas Farrakhan was the dominant voice of Black folks and Black America back in the 1980s and early 1990s, since the mid-1990s and up to the present, there are a plethora of dominant voices today, albeit grassroots level, that are championing the cause of Black centered consciousness and liberation, including the likes of Bobby Hemmit, Rev. Phil Valentine, Alim Bey, Ashra Kweisi, Jewel Pookrum, Ashra Kweisi, Dr. Delbert Blair, and most recently, the fiery and energetic Sara Suten Seti who uses 'You Tube' to convey his fiery and 'real talk' message to the masses of Black people and is greatly loved, respected, and well-received by the masses of Black people, especially on a grassroots level.

Now while Seti does use very strong language to convey his message and to educate (which can be quite hilarious at times), he's very convincing to many for the simple fact that he backs up his talk with actual facts, usually material from black researchers, historians, and scholars. Not to mention, he's very energetic in his presentation. I believe his greatest asset is his "street" swag and disposition. Seti is down to Earth! He doesn't speak above the masses. He knows how to relate to the average brutha or sistah and make them understand what he is conveying to them. He is very successful in his approach (with a limited audience, of course); however, to those with refined ears, Seti may come off as obnoxious, belligerent, and uncouth.

As far as Islam (Nation of Islam) is concerned, while this religion and organization is most definitely dying a fast death amongst inner city Blacks and Blacks in general, there is one man who seems to be a beacon of hope for this faith and organization - Wesley Muhammad a/k/a True Islam.

True Islam, also known as the Black God, is very academically accomplished; however, in many respects, he loses credibility with people in the Hood (ghetto) because True Islam's education is undoubtedly attained from European institutions. True Islam clearly prides himself on the fact that he is very learned and degreed from major universities but he doesn't come off as the degreed and academically accomplished Dr. Khalid Abdul Muhammad, who could relate with the masses of Black people, especially the youth.

True Islam is very linear in the sense that his research stands to only validate the teachings of the Honorable Elijah Muhammad and the Nation of Islam, whereas Dr. Khalid Abdul Muhammad could not only validate the teachings of Elijah Muhammad and the Nation of Islam, but Khalid was strong and successful in linking the Teachings of the Nation of Islam with that of black nationalism and other black ideologies. Khalid created a strong tie with the Afrocentric community and was well respected and received by that community.

True Islam appears to be very restricted to Islamic research, and thus, his research and presentations only seek to reinforce Islam, but you can only reinforce something that has already been accepted by those who have chosen to believe (in that being reinforced), so at best, True Islam only stands to reinforce Islam to those who already embrace Islam and falls very short, or will fall very short, in reaching new people (in the audience) to come to the fold of Islam, especially Black youth. The only Islamic sect that is successful in reaching Black youth today is undoubtedly the NGE's (Nation of Gods and Earths or 5% Nation a/k/a 5 Percenters).

Wesley Muhammad has also offended the Hood by calling Black researchers who have not attended European universities - "Ghetto scholars" and their research "Ghetto scholarship."

True Islam's words, just like Seti's in some respect, clearly isolate and segment the community further. When you dis "ghetto scholars", you're dissin' the Hood (ghetto) where a lot of greatness comes from. Hip Hop was born in the ghetto. Language that you even hear Whites and people in the media and on T.V. use today, i.e. "It's all good!", "My bad!", "Off the chain!" came out of the Hood. Malcolm X came out of the Hood. Most of your greatest Black athletes came and come out of the Hood.

For that matter, I myself came out of the Hood and I guess I too am a "ghetto scholar" because I never attended college and I posses no degrees, but I ain't trippin' one bit because not being academically accomplished hasn't stopped me one bit in doing my life's purpose and impacting people on this planet, and more importantly, achieving financial freedom based upon putting my information, knowledge, wisdom, and understanding to work and receiving tangible results.

In my book, despite how academically degreed you are or may be, if you can't convert your scholarship, research, knowledge, understanding, theories and beliefs into major finances and get financially free, you're still a 'Poor Righteous Teacher' and your scholarship, research, and knowledge and everything else is for naught because it can't improve your quality of life in all areas of life.

Despite his knowledge, Dr. John Henrik Clark couldn't keep his eyes open in his latter days because of his Western European-based diet. His diet didn't change or improve based upon his knowledge.

Dr. Ben's health has deteriorated because despite his knowledge, he still ate a European diet.

It' the same thing with Louis Farrakhan and his colon and prostate problems. Deep down, despite all the Black philosophies, there's still some Eurocentric ways still being practiced (in some form) that seems to ultimately sabotage an individual and bring them down.

Knowledge is wholistic or it should be. How you gon' claim to be God and not know how to eat a diet conducive to your bio-genetic makeup? You're African but you're eating the Standard American Diet? You're God but you're eating the so-called Devil's diet? What's up with that? It doesn't add up! It's not mathematics!

A young brutha told me that he saw a picture of True Islam eating at McDonald's. Now if this is actually true, that's sad and pathetic considering the junk McDonald's sell and how you gon' be a researcher and not research food ingredients? True Islam can research for his religious beliefs but not research pertaining to what he puts in his mouth? And course, True Islam is not alone here as I'm quite sure many would be knowledgeable and conscious individuals are eating garbage. They'll drop all that heavy knowledge on street corners (very seldom do they speak on college campuses and receive honorariums) to passer-bys and when they are done, they'll leave and head for the first available KFC, Taco Bell, or McDonald's to et something to eat. This makes a serious statement to a truly conscious and thinking person.

You're God and you're eating at decadent McDonald's of all places? This kind of activity makes people who use common sense doubt folks who claim to have knowledge, supreme wisdom, divine mathematics, etc.

I remember watching old videos of Black Panther Party rallies and these cats (Stokely Carmichael, H. Rap Brown, et al.) were on stage smoking cigarettes. I was like: "What the hell?"

Nation of Islam minister Kevin Ali of Charlotte, North Carolina, claims to be a minister of the Honorable Elijah Muhammad (who taught "Do For Self") for over 20 years and Minister Kevin, still in 2009, works for the White man whom he claims is his enemy! I just don't get it! At what point does a message kick in and is finally applied by the person professing a thing? 20 years of being a minister and you still haven't gotten free of the White man's job? Something is wrong with the thinking here!

I have learned many things from all the schools of thoughts mentioned above and have applied what I have chosen to keep from my various studies. However, I wise enough to never limit myself in my studies and I learned in 1994 to never join an organization, but only draw from the information and knowledge and put it to work for yourself so as to become an asset to your community and humanity.

Apply the knowledge and become the knowledge! Live the knowledge! Get tangible results from the knowledge. Don't be a 'Poor Righteous Teacher!' Don't even claim this! Why claim to be poor? Why link righteousness with being poor? It makes an unconscious statement that if you're righteous and got knowledge, you'll be poor because most people will reject you and your message and so you'll catch hell, not make a lot of money or not make any money at all, or struggle financially.

People with wisdom, understanding, and knowledge, especially supreme knowledge, and who are conscious should be wealthy and rich! How can an unconscious fool (like a rapper) become rich and a man with knowledge and consciousness cannot? Isn't knowledge more powerful than ignorance, and consciousness more powerful than unconsciousness?

In closing, I am glad to hear that Wesley Muhammad sees the benefit of such a debate:

"Looking at brother Seti's display on this video may raise the very legitimate questions why would I waste time on this baffoonery? And, how might engaging it be in any way beneficial to the community? Well, I do believe Bro. Seti is worth the engagement and I do believe such engagement can - with the proper controls in place - be beneficial to the community." Comment by Wesley Muhammad taken from "FarrakhanFactor.com" website

Wesley is correct! Debates amongst Blacks can be beneficial and constructive if the proper controls are in place. One thing I can say about Wesley is that I know he can handle a professional debate and adhere to the rules of debate. I debated Kevin Ali and he broke the rules of the debate within the first 30 minutes of the debate, which caused the debate to spiral out of control of course. I was not used to that, being a student of professional debate.

So I trust that True Islam will represent in this respect and it is something that I would really like to see. Black debates usually become emotional and reason and logic are eventually sacrificed in the debate to reinforce religious and/or cultural beliefs and ideologies (and sometimes egos) and the biggest losers in situations such as this are those Blacks that are really intellectually inclined, sophisticated, refined, and erudite inclined.

True Islam may be unconscious of the fact that when he calls Seti's 'You Tube' presentations 'buffoonery' he's calling Kemetology 'buffoonery' and this adds fuel to the fire between the two camps (Islam and ancient Kemet).

"I have seen Bro. Seti in live, formal debate. I discovered that there are actually two "Seti's" the You Tube character Seti - the loud mouth who aims at 'shock value' through the things he says and the way he says them. This is the 'Hollywood' Seti that panders to his You Tube following. But there is actually a more reasonable Seti that shows up at debates. He still brings some of that loud mouth, hyper masculine Seti, but it is tamed a bit by his attempt to show himself a 'scholar' in the debate. Make no mistake about it: bro. Set is actually good. I am not validating him: he is already validated in a large segment of the community. We who love Islam cannot ignore him. There is no question in my mind that Bro. Seti is much more worthy of the engagement than the particular individuals those over here on this site [FarrakhanFractor.com] that I said I would not waste my time on. But make no mistake about it again: I will come strong. I will not feed into the popular misperception that the Muslims are now punks. I hope to show the people that one can be strong and civil at the same time. It will be a very exciting debate." Comment from Wesley Muhammad (True Islam), ibid

True indeed, it will be an exciting debate!

A big part of True Islam's reason in debating Seti is his need (and/or duty) to defend what he loves and believes in, which is Islam. This undoubtedly fuels True Islam because what we love gives us passion. But Seti also loves ancient Kemet and its wisdom, knowledge, understanding and its culture, so Seti too will be fueled.

Lastly, ponder over these words infra by Wesley Muhammad:

"This dialogue can be beneficial because, despite how revolted we as Muslims might be by brother's presentation, he is right now probably the undisputed leader (they call him 'the general') of a very significant movement in our community, the Afrocentrist/Black Nationalist R.B.G. movement ("Red Black and Green/Righteous But Gangsta) who claims as their 'Holy Trinity of Liberation" Dr. Yosef Ben-Yochannan, Dr. John Henry Clark, and Dr. Khalid Abdul Muhammad. So there is profound hate for Islam. Now, the aim of such a dialogue will not be to convert Bro. Seti. It is, however, to get to the AUDIENCE. The seeds of hate for Islam that he and others within the movement have planted in the minds of many of our people are not so well-entrenched that they cannot be uprooted with actual facts and sound argument. I do believe that with a properly formatted discussion our civility and sound arguments will ultimately prevail over his studio-gansta posturing and loud barking. The audience will have the choice between, as the Qur'an says, two ways that are 'conspicuous."

I don't think there is profound hate for Islam as Wesley claims. I simply think that people just don't embrace or feel Islam anymore like they used to due to what has been revealed about Islam. After all, it is a fact that Muslims enslaved Africans hundreds of years before Europeans and Christians. No one can refute this as it's well-documented. Even Bilal, companion of prophet Muhammad (PBUH) was a slave of the Arabs that Muhammad freed.

I don't think that in today's society and climate anyone can point out all the harm done to Blacks or Africans under the banner of Judaism and Christianity and then turn a blind eye to Islam which is also in line with Judaism and Christianity, forming a trinity of religions that have enslaved Africans and are responsible for the impaired collective African and African-American mind that is confused about God, culture, identity, history, purpose in life, etc.

Wesley also states his attempt is not to convert Seti (which he can't, and vice versa), but to get to the audience, and I can say, without any bias to the best of my ability, True Islam will greatly fall short here. When you deal with the audience, who will be in it? True Islam has already won the debate in the minds of Muslims, but all those people who are not Muslims, True Islam will have great difficulty in reaching them if he comes with his traditional approach. After all, many if not most, will come from the Hood (ghetto) that True Islam has already dissed.

Plus, people from the Hood don't really look up to learned and educated Blacks, nor do they really trust them. That's why no college educated person can reach more people in the Hood than these rappers; President Obama being the exception here but that's because he was running for the President of the U.S. and he was a Black man and the truth of the matter is that most Black people in America voted for Obama because of his skin color and the possibility of having a so-called first Black president. Most Blacks voted for black. Period! Tavis Smiley caught hell for this statement but Tavis told the truth.

Hopefully True Islam sticks to debating on traditional Islam and not the teachings of Elijah Muhammad and the Nation of Islam because Seti will have a field day ripping certain teachings apart, because the truth being is, much of what is taught in the Nation of Islam is not factual and cannot be proven with evidence whereas ancient Kemetic history is well documented.

Islam does have some very great, notable, and worthy of praise accomplishments which come by way of the Moors and documented in books such as Ivan Van Sertima's "Golden Age of the Moor" and Stanley Lane-Poole's "The Story of the Moors in Spain."

I have no personal interest in the June 27th debate, however, I am predicting Seti the hands down winner of the Debate, audience-wise, because the people are simply going to vibe with Seti more than Wesley Muhammad, who appears to be out of touch with the non-Islamic portion of the Hood, and more importantly, the youth!

However, this should not take away from Wesley's ability to provide clear and convincing facts (evidence) to substantiate his position and points raised and made during the debate. Wesley vowed he would come strong in the debate, but in addition, he'll need to be very convincing as well with his facts and his sources (evidence) and will need to present primary sources, and not secondary or tertiary sources.

Kevin Ali also vowed to come strong in our debate, however, to all non-Muslims, he failed miserably to be convincing in his facts (evidence) due to going as far as to use tertiary sources (i.e. quotes from the New York Times) and if True Islam comes like Kevin Ali came in our debate, it's lights out for him against Seti because to infer things predicated upon use of the imagination and a stretch of the imagination over that which is clear-cut and convincing holds no weight with the non-religious minded and independent thinking people of society, a lot of whom will be in attendance on June 27th.

Also, let me say that Seti may not just be the hands down winner exclusively due to audience appeal, because Seti is a good researcher and does know how to present facts to substantiate his claims and is very qualified to impress and influence the judges of the debate and win there as well. Seti comes with frosting as well as the cake, so make no mistake - True Islam is dealing with a very qualified and worthy debate opponent.

I believe the pressure will be on True Islam come June 27th due to his ability, or lack thereof, in relating to non-Islamic audiences.

The unfortunate thing about Black debates is that many times the audience chooses the frosting (STYLE) over the cake (SUBSTANCE: facts, information), which is an injustice to the true purpose of a debate. Sometimes, a person is said to have won a debate based upon pure emotionalism and not reason and logic. Emotionalism is for church or the mosque on Sunday. Debates are predicated upon use of logic and reason displayed through style.

The debate between Seti and True Islam is June 27th, 2009 in New York City, New York.

Thank you for reading!

This article is compliments of Dherbs.com and Djehuty Ma'at-Ra.